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Your husband is playing a sick and twisted game with your emotions, and your children are in the crossfire. He doesn't love you, he is fulfilling his immediate needs. Please open your eyes to the truth!

Please find an attorney ASAP. Protect yourself and your children. One parent needs to step in and be the adult in the room, he certainly isn't. STOP doing anything for him and focus solely on your children. No discussions except finances and kids and that's it.

He's using you for his selfish needs. Don't fall for his little game of ping pong with your life. Be strong.

@Owningitnow…yes! What you said in your last post is exactly what I keep thinking. His actions give me hope. No matter how hard I try I can’t pull away. I can’t believe it’s only been a week and a half. His pain and loss has made it feel so much longer.

@Dude67 yes my A was discussed at length. I would say mine was discussed way more than his in fact. It seems like the therapist is giving him a pass in some way. We aren’t trying to save the marriage anymore…well he’s not but it’s about getting along now that he’s not with us. The therapist did say that he had to admit the last 5 years was a betrayal because he acted so incredibly happy with me since he "forgave" me but if it was all a lie then he betrayed me. Took him a minute but he said yeah…he did. Therapist is telling Jordan he needs to figure out his needs and take care of himself. What about me?!! I’m left with all the responsibility! I said in our last session I didn’t think it was fair. I guess that’s why he does so much for me when he’s here.

I have a doc appt this morning. My anxiety meds have not been working and I haven’t slept more than a couple hours every night. Hoping I can get something stronger. It’s going to be embarrassing telling her what’s happened. She’s not a psych doc, just family doc.

[This message restored by Webmaster at 4:03 PM, Monday, December 6th]

[This message edited by keljpvs at 7:29 PM, Friday, December 3rd]

I think what keljpvs is thinking when she reads this is, "Then why does he tell me he loves me, have sex with me, stay overnight, and do kind things for me if he definitely does not love me?" Until we can explain how we know that, she will stick with her hope. - OwningItNow

Because those behaviors and actions have nothing to do with love. They have to do with him feeling good. Not you. Not your kids. Him.

How many people are here on this site because their partners did EXACTLY similar things with their APs?

You are thinking about this man like his behavior will be ethical, linear, and rational. It is not. You are treating his behavior like it will make sense through the lens of husband and father. It does not.

Why did he have sex with you and stay overnight this time? Because he wanted a feel good Thanksgiving experience. You and your children were accessories to his experience.

Think about that for a minute.

Your children are accessories to him.

He doesn't want to be responsible for their pain. He doesn't want to be their "whipping boy."

Really think about that for a minute.

He doesn't want to take responsibility for his actions.

What kind of parent abdicates responsibility for the emotional devastation of infidelity to their children?

What kind of person blows through boundaries and agreements like they mean nothing, because doing the opposite feels good to them?

Someone who is incredibly selfish. Someone who does not keep their word. Someone who is sick.

In the end, it doesn't matter AT ALL what he feels. What matters is that not every love is worth having. What matters is that not every "love" is good for us.

OP why are you still in MC? What is the end goal here for the both of you? What is the end goal for him? What is the goal for you?

I think you are torturing youself by attending MC. Yeah he might have admitted that he is betraying you and has for some time. But he does not care. He has already justified his actions and blaming your previous affairs. He is moving in with the AP, coming home to play happy family and getting extra sex with you. He is happy as they come and he is pushing you towards mental breakdown even more.

Did you ask him when he tells you that he loves you, what love for him means and why he loves you?

I think what keljpvs is thinking when she reads this is, "Then why does he tell me he loves me, have sex with me, stay overnight, and do kind things for me if he definitely does not love me?" Until we can explain how we know that, she will stick with her hope.

@Owningitnow…yes! What you said in your last post is exactly what I keep thinking. His actions give me hope. No matter how hard I try I can’t pull away.

Sweetie, you're seeing what you want to see here. You're cherry-picking as to what details you give meaning and priority to. Yes, he might have spent part of the day playing "happy family" with the kids and yes, he had sex with you the night before, but look what he did afterward... he "started turning cold" and went back to his girlfriend. It's not hard to figure out what his actions mean if you're willing to look honestly at what he's doing. We see this behavior all the time. No cheater wants to be the bad guy. They don't want their ex to be able to accuse them of "abandoning" the kids, so they show up and they play "happy families", and if you're offering, they will gladly accept all the "ego kibbles" they can stuff down including the horizontal pick-me dance which is top-notch kibble. He's got TWO women fussing and crying over him, telling him they can't do without him and BOTH putting out if he so much as crooks his finger. He is stuffing himself with kibbles right now, and if that means doing a few chores around the house to keep them coming, that's ALSO shit he tells himself so he won't feel like an asshole for breaking up his family. Read impression management. Have you ever heard the expression "he wants to have his cake and eat it too"? Your WH has got TWO never-ending cakes, and he's gobbling them both up. Why would he stop?

We aren’t trying to save the marriage anymore…well he’s not but it’s about getting along now that he’s not with us. The therapist did say that he had to admit the last 5 years was a betrayal because he acted so incredibly happy with me since he "forgave" me but if it was all a lie then he betrayed me. Took him a minute but he said yeah…he did. Therapist is telling {him} he needs to figure out his needs and take care of himself. What about me?!! I’m left with all the responsibility! I said in our last session I didn’t think it was fair. I guess that’s why he does so much for me when he’s here.

And this ^^^^ here above in the quote box, appears to be another one of those details that aren't head-lining for you. Discernment therapy isn't to save the marriage. It's to get YOU to play nice in the sandbox while he discards you. Note how he manages to turn therapy into kibbles too! Your therapist is encouraging him to take care of himself and there you are, holding the bag with the kids.

Let's imagine though what happens if you toughen up, tell him to stuff himself AND his therapist, get an attorney and file for divorce, child support, spousal support, exclusive use of the home, kids staying within the home state, and a nice fat MORALITY CLAUSE on top to prevent him from taking the kids around the OW for a year. Suddenly, things get real and you find out who you're dealing with because you've shut down kibble production and withdrawn cake. His initial reaction will be anger, and maybe that's what you've been avoiding??? But after that, he's going to need to CHOOSE. And maybe you're trying to avoid that too? Maybe what you're hoping is that HE will be the one to break this stalemate, but he's got no impetus to do that. Things are going just the way he wants them to. Look at the changes he's made just since you began this thread. He's already maneuvered you into accepting him living with the AP and yet coming in and out of your house like he still lives there. He's still got cake, only instead of living with you and seeing her on the side, he's living with her and seeing you on the side. Sweetie, he's maneuvering you. You can see it if you'll LOOK.

((hugs))

[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:43 PM, Friday, November 26th]

I guess that it wouldn't be a bad idea if you make an appointment just to talk to an attorney to find out what your rights are.

When my deceased WH was into the deepest part of his last affair and was divorcing me, I decided to seek a lawyer out to find out what my rights were. It really helped me to see what my potential future was going to look like.

At one time I was just like you; knew that my DWH was abusing me just as yours is, I was terrified of living out my life without him. Sad for my kids. Sad for the unknown.

Here I am today, over a year and a half without him. Still sad, still not quite sure what my future holds but also don't worry so much about that anymore because I am now living my life day to day. Going to be honest, it's a tough journey that I'm now on but would much rather be dealing with his death and reality of who he was verses what you are going through. At least now my life is authentic.

One thing for sure, if he miraculously came back to this earth, I would not take him back because I can now clearly see how abusive my DWH. Heck, I don't even want to meet up with him on the other side anymore. Lol

Another lesson I have learned is that my DWH was just a bad habit for me, just as yours is for you. And it wasn't because of the years we spent together as a married couple but because I stayed with him dispite his abuse, infidelities, untrustworthy behavior, cake eating like your WH is currently doing.

In the last several years of our marriage, now being honest with myself, I can see I stayed with him because I was afraid to be alone and I depended on him financially. I can clearly see now that it had nothing to do with love.

No matter what your WH keeps telling you, this is not love because love doesn't look like this. Love is faithfulness. Love is kindness. Love is honesty. Love is having yours and your kid's back and not hurting the mother of his children. Love doesn't f*** other women.

I do not love my DWH anymore because of who he really was. I loved who I wanted him to be. I think that this is your problem too.

I know that you mentioned lack of finances as your driving factor for staying in your marriage and also to keep your family together but please understand it is not about love. And you are also teaching your kids by staying with him that this is okay.

I was visiting my son in another state recently and I told him that my DWH didn't want to be a husband and father and my son quoted back to me, well he doesn't have to be either of these anymore. What a great and true response. My DWH finally got what he wanted.

I know that it is scary to take those first initial steps towards loving yourself but if you can't do it for yourself, do it for your kids. In time, you will be happy that you did.

I have a house full of company but need to address what the others have told you. He does not want a hysterical woman moaning all over town. He hopes that your guilt of your affair is going to keep you quiet. I hope I am wrong but you need to understand he has no loyalty to you. He is protecting his new lover. He is probably getting his finances fixed. In other words he wants you to shut up and not make any demands on him.
SEE A LAWYER ASAP You have children to provide for.

OP, if you want to torture yourself with the pick-me dance, that’s your prerogative as an adult.

But it’s extremely unfair to your kids to tolerate his behavior. He’s not just messing with your head; he’s messing with theirs. Why is that acceptable to you?

Keljpvs,

After my husband discovered my affair, he told me we had to get divorced. But he dangled the carrot of possible reconciliation afterwards, after the divorce was final. For two weeks we continued to have sex and he told me he loved me and didn’t want to be apart, but he couldn’t be married to a cheater. Even after I moved out (at his request), he kept my hopes up.

Until he found someone else, one of my good "friends" at the time actually. Once he started fucking her, his tune changed—he told me we were permanently over—it wasn’t until his relationship with her didn’t work out that he then asked me to get back together.

Nothing was the same again, though. We stupidly remarried and had a couple of kids, and now we are miserable and have no relationship aside from roommate/coparenting.

Don’t be me.

Because those behaviors and actions have nothing to do with love. They have to do with him feeling good. Not you. Not your kids. Him.

How many people are here on this site because their partners did EXACTLY similar things with their APs?

My xWH did exactly the same things. He wasn't doing it for me. He was doing it so he could tell himself the narrative that he's a good person, he isn't doing anything wrong, and look how well he was treating me.

That's not love. That's pure selfishness and a way to rewrite the trauma he is causing.

keljpvs, when you have sex and play family with your husband and then he leaves to be with his mistress, do you feel energized, nourished, and fulfilled? Or do you feel drained, anxious, and empty?

What BluerThanBlue said.

He keeps telling me he’s never coming back but then his actions show he still loves me. His attitude changes all the time and I grow more and more confused.

OK, so bolting out the door on Thanksgiving to go back to his paramour is showing you he loves you? I'm having a bit of trouble wrapping my head around all of that.

He doesn't love you.
He doesn't love his children.
He doesn't love his paramour.

He only loves and values himself, and he is going to continue to eat cake until one or both of you shut down the bakery.

If you do anything today, please read the above and start to believe it.

I would find a good IC (not the current one who coddles him) for you to work through the betrayal and trauma. I would also get an attorney and file, as so many of us have suggested and encouraged. File for child support, visitation, exclusive use of the marital home, a financial restraining order, and a motion to keep the children away from OW for a minimum of one year. You cannot afford to not protect yourself. He could take out an equity line of credit on your home. He could obtain new credit cards for which you would be on the hook for at least part of any balance. He could cash out his 401(k) or retirement account so you couldn't get it. You really REALLY need to file NOW. Otherwise, you put yourself in financial jeopardy.

I really hope you hang the closed sign on the bakery and start protecting yourself. He's not going to. Ever.

Cat

keljpvs I’m just gonna keep it real, your husband never forgave you. The pain that your husband ate and stuffed deep deep deep down inside, has erupting into this monster you’re currently degrading yourself over. You are in trouble, because as you are voluntarily living in an alternate universe than the one where your husband is openly planning a life with someone else. He doesn’t want you, he’ll sleep with you yes, but as you yourself know, love doesn’t = sex. He’ll play family man here and there so that he can keep being the good guy in his story. Also lulls you into this false sense of comfort as I am certain he is getting his ducks in a row as he plans to move away with this girl. Plus he’s likely enjoying inflicting hurt on you in some perverted revenge. If I read your posts correctly, your husband has been planning to purposely push you away, to make you break, yet you keep hanging on refusing to let him go. Your husband is abusing you right now and the more you take it, the crueler he’ll get, you may think you’re showing him "how much you love him" but I promise you’re achieving the exact opposite of your goal, you’re repelling him.

End.the.marriage.counseling.now. Makes absolutely no sense to be wasting your time, energy and money when your husband is in an active ongoing affair he has no intentions of ending ever.

RETAIN AN ATTORNEY. You are so incredibly vulnerable right now and sad to say, being negligently foolish.

get an attorney and file, as so many of us have suggested and encouraged. File for child support, visitation, exclusive use of the marital home, a financial restraining order, and a motion to keep the children away from OW for a minimum of one year. You cannot afford to not protect yourself. He could take out an equity line of credit on your home. He could obtain new credit cards for which you would be on the hook for at least part of any balance. He could cash out his 401(k) or retirement account so you couldn't get it. You really REALLY need to file NOW. Otherwise, you put yourself in financial jeopardy.

All of this!!!

What about me?!! I’m left with all the responsibility!

It’s not about you!! You have already been where your husband is right now. A place where you were utterly consumed with only your desires and paid no mind to anyone else and how what you did harmed them. You should understand your husband’s head space, but the difficulty you’re having may be that you never left that head space. Yes, you’re left with all the responsibility, as your husband was when you were having affairs. But even if you weren’t a Madhatter, as much as you wish it weren’t, this is your reality. And it’s unfair. But you have to start thinking and acting selflessly for your kids. Because both you and your husband’s current behavior are destroying them. They need at least one of their parents to start putting them first. It’s gonna have to be you because your husband’s openly and actively leaving the three of you. Your kids didn’t ask to be here and they didn’t ask for the parents they got.

Neither of you are placing your children as even your second priorities, and you are messing up your kids.

Rasputina generously disclosed a part of her life to you in an effort to assist you. You didn’t acknowledge it, but I hope that doesn’t mean you’re ignoring it. I re-posted it b/c you need to pay attention as it’s a glimpse into your future if you don’t start prioritizing your kids over trying to keep your husband.

keljpvs --

I'm speaking to you now from my position as a betrayed child long since grown, and it's going to be some very tough love.

Love because my heart absolutely aches for you, and for the intense pain and upheaval your family is collectively experiencing.

Tough because tonight I sit in watchful vigil for an adult sibling who almost every year on this day completely disintegrates due to the decisions and behaviors of our long dead, abusive, cheating father coupled with our mother who struggled to set safe boundaries for her children many, many years ago until her hand was forced...and I see some of that in your story.

Do you know what my mother is doing tonight? After the turkey and pies are all put away, and the guests long gone? She's sitting in the dark of her kitchen by the phone, waiting for contact from either her very troubled adult child, or the police who are out looking at the place she was told she could expect to find their body earlier tonight. She's either going to get a call for a ride home or the kind of notification no parent wants to receive. This has happened many times before over many years, and I hope the outcome will not be worst case scenario tonight.

I share this because you seem to be so focused on the present of this man that you perhaps can't see the future of your children. My family is a glimpse of that possible future.

You are choosing this sick man over your children when you choose to submerge yourself in this toxic dynamic.

I'm sorry if it's hard hearing that unsavory truth. If it's any consolation, it's much harder living that as the child caught up in the nasty undertow.

Your husband isn't choosing you. Your husband isn't choosing his children. Your husband isn't being any kind of good father or partner right now; he's being an addict, drugged with all the incredibly intense feelings his behavior is eliciting in his unhealthy brain. Addicts are selfish. Addicts are unsafe. You cannot change an addict, no matter how much you love them. You cannot love an addict into how you think they should act.

Why are you letting an addict into your home...your bed...your children's safe place? Why are you letting an addict steal their future wellness and potential well-being?

Your children are trapped in this abusive, toxic, unhealthy family dynamic...swirling in orbit around the kind of toxic foundational relationship that leads to crippling issues in later life...and it WILL poison them if one of their parents doesn't start choosing them.

Right now neither of your children's parents are choosing them.

Are you mom enough to change that?

Are you mom enough to put the wife...the wayward...the guilt...the longing...the co-dependency...all of that aside to throw a life raft to your children?

I'll tell you one thing. My mother desperately wishes she could go back in time to do that tonight, but that window has long since closed. Children don't stay children forever. Sometimes they become very broken adults.

Sometimes the right choices feel impossible.

And sometimes love means being tough.

Sometimes with yourself.

What about me?!! I’m left with all the responsibility!

If you file as has been suggested many times, you set up a visitation schedule (and visitation takes place outside your home and NOT in the presence of the OW--up to him to figure out how that happens) so that you have time to recharge and regroup. He may be a crappy co-parent (I suspect this will be the case) but the children need a relationship with him and he needs to step up and be present in their lives. Many states have a mandatory parenting class for divorcing parents with minor children. If yours does, he may realize how he needs to be present. Or he may not. You can't control this in any way, shape or form.

The alternative is to file for sole custody. Yes, it's more responsibility on you. Yes, it is a pain and a burden, particularly when you get very little relief from 100% hands-on parenting. But someone has to be the adult here, and it looks like you drew the short stick.

I would direct your focus away from him, as it is keeping you trapped and taking hits on the "hopium" pipe. Your reality is that he wants out. So show him what "OUT" is. File as all of us have been encouraging you to do. It's the ONLY thing you can do right now to protect yourself and your kids. As long as you keep the bakery open, he's going to be eating cake.

Cat

keljpvs - I’ve been thinking about you, how are things going?

Wow,ypu people are so wrong this time. Do you realy not see what is situation here? Her husband is probably not a good looking man,she was his love when they were young,but she didnt love him then. But,he saved her from abusive relationship and they were just friends,but he told her he loves her and she agreed to be with him becouse of security. She didnt love him nearly as much as he loved her. If you dont believe me,ask her. Then,it came a time in the mariage when he didnt give her so much attention,and what did she do? She went and she tried to find someone elce who will adore her and start a new life. She tried 5 men,and the last one told her he will live with her,so she told her hisband she wants a divorce! Then he found out what she had done. He was devastaded bud he had two small sick children and he just couldnt leave then. But time has passed,children grow up,and he met someone who is good to him,something that he craved for but he was afraid that no one woud be with him if he gets a divorce. Now,he has somebody to be with,and now he is ready to divorce his cheating wife. Is it fair? No its not,but thats life.Not one time did OP said that her husband is a handsome man,and her describing OW shows that she is sure that OW isnt in love with her husband,that she is just using him. That man has suferred for 5 years,finally he met someone and decided to begin a new life. He did it in cruel way,but maybe he thinks that his cheating wife deserved that,in his eyes she probably did.

????

@FairyTaleGone thanks for checking in. Been miserable and depressed this holiday season. He continues to blame me for everything under the Sun and I still continue to love him. I just don’t know how to let go.

No more physical love so I’m feeling discarded and super lonely. We fight more and more as I just want him to understand my pain and he wants me to understand his happiness.

I miss him terribly and it feels like I will never feel whole again. He really was my everything. I still cry every day. My kids go through the roller coaster of different emotions depending on what is going on.

Please tell me how to let go and be ok.

@DjDjani he is a very handsome man. I know I did him wrong and trust me…I have paid the price. I’ve lost him and the agony I now experience is more than I can bear. No excuses for what I did. Doesn’t matter how mean he was or how unloved I felt at the time. I should have dealt with it differently and the guilt will never go away.

[This message edited by keljpvs at 4:50 PM, Tuesday, December 28th]

We fight more and more as I just want him to understand my pain and he wants me to understand his happiness.

It's a lot less stressful and more successful to teach a gerbil calculus than it is to get him to understand your pain.

You're dispatching yourself on a fool's errand and hoping that something you tell him will resonate with him.

News flash: it won't. He's eyeballs deep into his affair and you are the enemy right now.

The only thing you can do is to see an attorney and file, as everyone has been advising. He's not able to give you what you need right now. He may never have that capability again. Talking about it won't do a damn thing.

I'm recommending a book called Love Must Be Tough by James Dobson. It's a really good book for where you are right now, and it should give you the encouragement to send him packing. Because seriously, nothing is going to change right now.

When WE change, others around us cannot NOT change.

Cat