SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

A question for waywards. I have been working through my timeline and detailing all infidelity. When I first met my BS I was quiet and not hugely confident. I had one sexual partner before meeting BS. We were together for a few months before I took a job in another city (about an hour and a half away). I was living on my own initially and then moved into a shared house. During this time I did check out other women, but did not approach. I would watch porn and imagine myself with different women. I would have sexual fantasies about a female at work any would masturbate over her. I was thinking that I had not had that much experience with women and these fantasies were a way of me gaining more experience, even if it were in my head.

I was offered a management position in another branch and accepted. I had a brief handover with this woman. We would hold meetings and discuss the existing staff members, these would sometimes be unprofessional as we were making jokes about a couple of them. We were overheard one day by another staff member (she agreed with our comment, but we were still concerned about other conversations being heard). We held the next couple of staffing related meetings in a bar across the street. Later in the handover I spoke to the supervisor who had overheard our conversation and discussed the fact that I was planning to move into the area. I would be moving into the house where the current manager lived and take her room on. The supervisor told me that she thought the two of them were sleeping together and that the manager was know for sleeping around.

This news made me think that I could make a move on her and as she was moving away there would be no risk of getting caught. She was only going to be in the town for another week. We arranged for me to meet her landlord one evening after work, in the bar opposite. We had a few things to do in the office that day and I wanted to check if she were interested in me. I brushed my hand against hers and she smiled and responded by doing the same. This continued until we had completed the paperwork and we headed to the bar. Once there we bought drinks and the touching continued. I touched her leg under the table and had my hand on her knee until the landlord arrived. We all had a drink together and headed back to his so I could see the room. We spoke about rent and when I could move in and then had a couple of drinks in the house to get to know one another. I was sat next to AP during this time and continued the touching. The landlord left the room and I moved my hand brushed it over her breast. The landlord came back in and I backed off again. Soon after she said she was tired. I agreed and suggested that I should stay over as it was getting a bit late and the trains home were less frequent. The landlord said I could crash on the couch. AP said she would get me a pillow. I looked at her and she said she was tired and going to bed. I did not stay over and headed home.

I knew this woman for barely a week and I was propositioning her for sex. Something I had not done before. BS and I are struggling with the lack of buildup. There was no kissing at any point. I heard she was "easy" and decided to make a move. Is his lack of build up, given I had not done this before normal? BS is convinced I’m telling more lies. I’m not, but I do see her point. I’ve minimised so much and told BS nothing happened with other APs when something actually did. This was my first physical act of infidelity and I’m trying to understand what we’re the steps in the chain, the choices I made so I was ok with doing this? When challenged by BS I try and explain but end up getting defensive (which has historically meant I was lying). This then pushes me further from her and I shut down.

I need help getting to the bottom of this. How I went from faithful to unfaithful in a short space of time with little obvious build up. Can you question me as I’m struggling digging deep by myself and get upset when BS tries.

EDIT - A quick edit to add this was my first "physical" act of infidelity. I had done nothing like this before while with my BS. I highlight "physical" as watching porn, checking out other women, having fantasies about other women is an act of infidelity if it is not known by your partner or if it gets in the way of that relationship.

I was not watching a huge amount of porn at this time. I had a couple of video tapes (This was pretty much pre internet) and access to a cable tv porn channel.

[This message edited by Bulcy at 9:23 PM, Thursday, February 17th]

I think some things have simple answers.

With this particular affair and of course I can't put myself in your head and dig for deeper meaning. I wouldn't necessarily say there was little obvious build up,  its pretty obvious to me that you saw an opportunity and acted on it. No offense as I am one too but serial cheaters don't need a build up. They just need an opportunity and a willing person.

You already crossed that line before which makes it incredibly easy to do it again. These things don't just happen. They are planned and you began with planting seeds via fantasies. Whether there was intent to follow through or not at that point, upon finding out she may be easy it certainly became a reality for you.

I think plain ol opportunity and want-to are largely over looked as whys. Especially for serial cheaters. Of course there is always something behind that.

Low self worth, inadequacy, and the variety, know what's a quick hit to sooth those feelings? Sex and external validation. Its not enough our spouses want us, chose to be with be us, love us and think we are enough. We need a constant stream coming in. Our bucket is full of holes and no one person can fill it. I like to imagine the bucket holes as a spiral starting at the bottom and going to the top. The holes getting bigger and bigger as they move up.

There's a slow leak at first where the holes are the smallest as we are trying to fill them. We feel it but we don't quite understand what's going on. So we put more into it, grasping at anything to make us feel better, still its not enough. And now its taking more, not to mention all this time its still pouring out from below. We can hardly keep up. We progress in our endeavor crossing lines for instant gratification, validation, whatever it takes. Its just a bottomless pit.

Anyway, that wasn't exactly what you were looking for here. Rather throwing questions out. Can you tell us what questions your BS has asked first? And your answers to them? I think that would be a better start.

Take this with a grain of salt, because I'm not a serial/SA myself, so I'm speculating based on what I've read rather than my own experience.

I personally have no problem with porn. For me, it's a component in our healthy sex life as a couple. Sometimes we watch it alone, sometimes we watch it together. Until I arrived here, I always thought that people who had problems with consensually filmed porn were either Puritan types or eyebrow-raisingly insecure.

I don't think that anymore, at least not automatically, because I've learned how for some users, porn is an escalation gateway. Frequent use can numb an addict to its effect, so they engage in progressively riskier behavior to get the hormonal hit they're accustomed to. Viewed through that lens, your pass at your coworker didn't come out of nowhere. You'd been working your way up to it in your head, always justifying it as mere fantasy. This is dangerous for waywards, sex addict or not. We do most of the work of cheating in our heads before we ever make a move, while healthy people might be able to indulge in a one-off fantasy about an attractive person and then let it go.

Thanks for the replies. I will respond to them tomorrow, I've had a shitty day at work and need to go to bed. Just wanted to say that I am reading and will digest. FYI I've added to my original post by way of clarification.

Bulcy, you seem to have had the mindset to cheat since the beginning of the relationship. From what you describe, it appears you had some sort fear of missing out with other women. You setup your whole internal sexual fantasy life as some sort of method of achieving that goal. You cheated many times mentally before you ever did it IRL. You jumped on the first chance to take a spin on the office bike because the opportunity was there and you thought you could get away with it.

So it wasn't just a week for you to cheat, you had already made your mind up before you met the AP.

Hi Bulcy,

Any other thoughts on this?

I was thinking more about your situation and wondering a few things. Did your BW have more experience than you when you came into your relationship? I think for some men that can be intimidating. It looks like that kind of insecurity combined with FOMO may have played heavily into your porn use.

I'm one of those users who finds porn to be highly problematic, both from a religious and a psychological perspective. As well as from a person who just doesn't put up with it perspective too, so maybe salt this as you will . The religious and psychological aren't really exclusive of each other either. One plays into the other.

Anyhow, porn in general objectifies the people filmed. Turns them into commodities to be bought and sold and really depersonalizes sex. Makes it not about the person and what they mean to you, but about the release you can obtain. It's not a far slide from there to using an AP in a similar manner. I agree with the others here that your porn use was the gateway drug to the A.

All this to say, between your insecurities and FOMO and then using port to numb yourself from those feelings, it's not hard to see how quickly the A happened. You were actively seeking the external validation of your physical manhood and looking for more variety of sexual experiences from the get go.

I'm not trying to condemn you for the porn use. It's really understandable, honestly. I have huge insecurities, inferiority and a lot of shame I'm working through. During my mental breakdown and A, I basically was using my AP as a drug to numb me to my own internal pain and shame. Learning to give that to myself and accept what I've done and myself as a person who could be sexy for my BH and worthy of the attention he wants to give me are SO HARD right now. My A really did nothing to "fix" what was wrong with me- it only layered on more shit for me to digest. Porn, AP's, they're really the same kind of thing. Like meth vs opioids. Pick your poison.

What have you been doing to address these things? The shame from the A adds another layer to the shit sandwich of having these internal insecurities and feelings of inferiority. Are you addressing this in IC?

Did your BW have more experience than you when you came into your relationship?

No, this was not the case. Although some of my male friends did (or said they did at least)

It looks like that kind of insecurity combined with FOMO may have played heavily into your porn use.

It is possible, but the porn usage was very limited at this time. It became more of a problem later in the relationship.

What have you been doing to address these things? The shame from the A adds another layer to the shit sandwich of having these internal insecurities and feelings of inferiority. Are you addressing this in IC?

I don't watch porn by myself any more BS and will occasionally watch together. We've been using it as a guide to sexual fantasies, for me to show her what I was looking at before d-day and to get some sexual excitement together prior to sex. We're viewing less often recently. It did bring feelings of shame initially, especially when looking at things I was viewing by myself. Things that I did find arousing then, I am shocked by mow as the images and videos are awful. I agree that shame is a big problem for me. As I've said often, I shut down when when things get difficult or I'm challenged. BS and I have discussed porn and t is a lot less "triggery" for both of us.

I am discussing with IC how I shut down. The last couple of sessions have been talking about emotional intelligence and communication. Both of which have caused me problems. We will be discussing the above in the coming weeks. She is a new IC for me, so is only just coming to terms with my past.

I feel I've "grown up" a fair bit recently but still need work on the "It's all about me" selfishness. Reading Linda MacDonald and the pinned threads on here are helping to keep my mind focused on BS/us/me when thinking about or discussing infidelity.

So it wasn't just a week for you to cheat, you had already made your mind up before you met the AP.

I think you might be right there Buck. I'll consider these words in depth and discuss with IC on Tuesday

I have minimised the porn use in my post above. It is true to say that I was not watching much porn in this initial stage. I'm not sure this would have impacted me that much or been a big catalyst in my wayward thoughts and actions. I'm not discounting it, it could be one step of many towards infidelity. Certainly I was of the opinion it was harmless.

The porn use later in my relationship however was substantially more damaging and more frequent. For years I was rarely physical with my BS and would use porn to help satisfy myself. Porn played a massive part in my life. Addicted? I don't think so!?! It was often, yes. I struggle accepting addiction though. BS does not think addiction either.

Hi Bulcy,

Yeah, maybe not addiction on the level of porn use. However, you do realize it was impacting your relationship with your spouse negatively. That is what I would focus on going forward- the coping mechanisms you used that negatively impacted your relationship with your spouse.

It's good you're doing the work and really digging on this. Keep it up!

FAO - A Mod. Can you take the stop sign off please?

The Stop Sign has been removed at Bulcy's request. Please post accordingly.