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Although, I still believe he was justified initially in his anger, this is so beyond acceptable. Now, he's just drama and wasted energy. Please value your peace of mind and start getting yourself ready to walk away from him. I know this is not what you want to hear. Life is too short to tolerate people making you miserable. I'm sorry. I really am.

Thanks StillLivin.

Another update:

This morning before he left I went downstairs to say goodbye (I wfh) and he apologized profusely, said he was acting like a d**k, wished he could take everything back, apologized again, said he loves me and wants to be with me and wishes he could pretend it never happened, but knows that he/we can’t. He was teary (which I’ve only seen 3-4x total in 8.5 years).

I thanked him and said I needed to hear that, but that I’m still terribly hurt and he apologized again.

So, time will tell.

The way he's treating you isn't right, regardless if his crocodile tears. He has some work to do on himself, and you can't do it for him. Fwiw, my advice remains the same. Start detaching and getting your ducks in a row to a break up. If he gets his head out of his ass, that's great, but you do you in the meantime.

Yeah. I know. :(

There’s going to have to be a conversation.

I think at this point, there have been enough conversations. You're wasting your breath. If he's wiling to get into counseling, maybe. But, really, at this point it's obvious he still has baggage he needs to jnpack, and that's not your job to fix him. Watch his actions while detaching and preparing to leave. If his actions start to align with what is acceptable, you can work with that and take a few steps back. But the writing is on the walls that he isn't where he should be mentally to be in a HEALTHY relationship. Im sorry. I know you've invested time and energy and developed real feelings. But imagine 10 years from now with no changes. Would this be a healthy relationship?

Hey nekorb,

Any updates?

Thanks for checking in little turtle, and for the advice StillLivin.

The update is sort of a non-update.

I’m sitting back and letting things lie for the moment pending his upcoming medical procedures.

I’m watching his actions which, towards me, have been loving and kind.

Can’t remember if I mentioned my DD is pregnant with my first grandbaby. :) They are having a gender reveal party in a couple of weeks. The entire family is invited including my ex and her stepmom (as they should be). It will be the first time I’ve met their stepmom (who seems lovely by all accounts, I wish I could have warned her about NPD!), and the first time G5 will meet my ex.

I am already having anxiety about this. G5 is already expressing how uncomfortable it’s going to be, he isn’t going to enjoy himself, wants nothing to do with my ex/has no desire to meet him, he still isn’t talking to my son in law…

I don’t get it. I don’t understand how someone who stated he has a zero tolerance policy for drama can be so confrontational and cause so much drama and not even see it.

I did suggest at one point during our previous argument that perhaps we could talk to someone to help us learn a better way of resolving conflict. He responded he is not going to counseling and doesn’t believe in it. So, the likelihood of him going to IC is slim. He needs it.

Over the summer I really thought we had turned a corner on this topic. He suggested a big family get together at our house, his son came, my kids were all there, my parents, we had games in the front yard and food and everyone just hung out all day and had a good time. And now here we are.

Once his medical situation has calmed down there is going to have to be a conversation. I need a healthy partner. Our relationship is causing me anxiety and that isn’t a good thing. I think if he’s honest about it, it’s causing him anxiety as well. We really enjoy each others company and get along in so many other ways. Perhaps that’s why we are both still here.

Maybe we should have just been FWB and let it run its course. IDK.

I’m so confused.

Additional minor update…

I just left my attorney’s office. I explained to her what happened recently and she advised taking him out of my Trust/estate planning and only making other changes we had talked about.

I followed her advice and feel somewhat relieved.

It makes me sad, but I need to take care of myself first and foremost.

Thanks for the update, nekorb. I hope things calm down for you and your anxiety lessens.

The attorney telling you that must have been a huge pill to swallow, but often the best advice they give us is a shock. Glad you did that.

It just seems like your ability to forgive and move on is far more developed than his. Perhaps it is a temperament difference, or the values you were raised with, that sound quite different.

In my family, we 4 siblings each had a divorce to cope with and yet some of us handled situations like your family gathering with more grace than others of us could manage, and we grew up in the same family! A lot of the differences had to do with who the Xs were and how badly they did my brothers or sister. Like, none of us ever wanted to see my sister's SAWXH again! At the other extreme, for years I was really sad and disappointed in one Sister-in-Law because she ran off with another woman's husband after 26 years married to one of my alcoholic brothers and left him with custody of their 3 high school children. Yet at his funeral, of course she came (thankfully without her 2nd H) and she really reached out to me. Since my brother had long since forgiven her, I felt like I had to make the best of it.

So it just sounds like you are both coming from a very different place regarding how to deal with your families. Does his family happen to have a pattern of 'cutting people out of their lives' permanently? I'd ask him to explore that. We did a counseling class in my psych coursework that had us draw up "genograms" that look like expanded genealogy charts and sure enough, as the professor predicted, many of us saw repeating patterns of broken relationships and also how we dealt with others, stretching back generations. (We had to draw a line with x marks through it between memebers who had divorced or dumped the other party. Mine was a real mess!)

Two things:

1. I can do without drama in my life, but some people love it, even if they say they don’t.

2. I don’t know any of the men my wife was with before me (if there were any), and I don’t want to. I don’t want to stand and talk to some guy who’s looking at my wife and remembering her naked, etc. Is it childish, immature, insecure? I guess, but I have some sympathy for G5 on this one, and maybe you should, too. But, if it’s an important family gathering, he should suck it up.

[This message edited by Formerpeopleperson at 9:07 PM, Saturday, February 22nd]

Thanks everyone.

His family does, in fact, have a history of just cutting people off and never speaking again. His FOO was abusive and dysfunctional. He has brought some of the dysfunction and dysregulation along for the ride it seems. I’m fairly certain he sees his behavior as normal, reasonable self preservation mechanisms.

Formalpeopleperson - interesting you mention that. He specifically mentioned not wanting to chat with a guy that has had sex with me. I personally don’t understand that. I’m not saying it’s wrong, just that I don’t get it. I would have no qualms about meeting G5’s ex wife. He doesn’t currently want to have sex with her. He doesn’t want to be with her. Why do I care what happened between them long ago? But in any case, I appreciate that you shared that.

This is a big deal for my daughter and her husband, there will be a lot of people there to buffer, etc. I’m not asking him to pal around with my ex and he BFFs, I am asking him to be cordial and not act like an ass and be pissy throughout the event.

This is so anxiety provoking. I don’t want to bring it up until after his medical procedure and results. He specifically stated he is really worried and preoccupied with that right now and can’t handle much else, so I’m doing my best to pack it up and shelf the topic for the moment.

Even if we were to end things I would anticipate he will be living here for awhile and I’m ok with that. I hope it doesn’t come to that.

Thanks for listening!

Hey SI friends,

Another non-update, aka I need to talk. ;)

Things, for me, have been anxiety ridden. His medical procedure is next week, and I’ve shelved the topic for the moment pending this procedure/results. But it hasn’t stopped me from feeling sad, hurt, afraid of his reaction when I want to discuss it, etc. I’m prone to random bursts of crying if I think about that fight for too long.

I honestly feel like a depression has settled over me since then. I’m trying to engage in my normal activities, be excited about DD’s pregnancy (which I am!), my new job is going really well, I’m just sad.

When he said he was ending our relationship and moving out, I remember sitting there quietly and thinking to myself, "I am not going to beg like I did with my ex…it did too much damage to me". And I let go…and I’m having a hard time reengaging.

Does that make sense? I’m trying to reengage, I really am. Trying to do our normal things, enjoy our normal banter, but I’m struggling.

He told me he ended our relationship to hurt me, because he was feeling hurt. He said I was just like his ex, and this felt just like his marriage. He said he didn’t love me "in that moment".

He hurt me on purpose.

This is where I am stuck.

First of all, I deserve unconditional love, and I deserve to have a partner that understands love is not a feeling, it’s a choice.

I am not denying that I said things that hurt him, but it was not deliberate, it was poorly delivered observations that were meant to be reflective, but instead it was hurtful.

I don’t think he sees a distinction between these things. Am I wrong here?

IDK.

I also feel guilty. He sold his home to move in with me, the place where he raised his kids. He probably would have stayed there forever had he not moved in with me. If we can’t get things worked out, he’s in a position of buying something in a terrible housing market. I get this shouldn’t be part of my thought process, but it is. I feel that if he still owned his home that he would have left that day and it would have been over. I no longer feel secure in our relationship.

I don’t think he understands the damage that was done that day from my POV. I’m sure I will be accused of causing drama.

I’m sad.

I’m anxious.

I’m breathing in and out every day.

I’m trying to focus on good things that are happening - new job, grandbaby coming.

p.s. I’ve actually thought of reaching out to my therapist (or a therapist) for the first time in forever, but I’m reluctant to do that because I know what she will say: this is an unhealthy situation. That in and of itself is telling. I think if he’s honest, G5 would say our relationship has become stressful for him as well. I don’t think he was prepared for feeling so out of control when he sold his house and moved in here. Disclaimer: I’m making assumptions about his feelings.

[This message edited by nekorb at 2:47 PM, Saturday, March 1st]

Nekorb, I've been off here lately what with all the spamming it is discouraging (and infuriating for the great mods!❤️)

Glad to dialog, even though not glad you are feeling the depression you are. I have a couple random thoughts.
1. That moment when you disconnected was a total flashback to your betrayal in your previous relationship, wasn't it? They say that every trauma brings up ALL prior traumas we haven't "forgotten." (But who ever forgets, anyway?) So NO WONDER it hit you and changed something. You thought you were past all that.

2. Perhaps something like that triggered him too, since he said it was just like his marriage TO HIM. I don't really think he meant YOU, specifically, so much as the role you are in as his significant other, if that makes sense. And that would explain his reversal, claiming he didn't mean what he said to YOU. It was him speaking to his trauma?

Ghosts from the past suck.

3. But I think it's huge that he sold his house where he raised his kids, with all those associations and pride of ownership, because among other things, it means now he's off any equity leveraging that house might have provided him to springboard to some other home. You hadn't said that before, but I can relate. (I was newly tied into a joint mortgage for the place we purchased by cash-out refinancing my home when my WH decided to cheat.)

When your BF made that decision, he obviously wasn't feeling insecure about the relationship BUT his saying this year that he felt like he was back in his old marriage was maybe him saying if he'd known he'd EVER feel like that again, he wouldn't have taken such a big leap. Still, selling his house was the decision he made, probably based on a lot of factors, so that's kinda on him. But you also are thinking he would have bowed out of your relationship had that other home still been there, and that is major-major. I think your feelings are totally understandable, under the circumstances!

So maybe he needs to be someone who has his own turf, in which he feels he can call all the shots (like justsomeguy is doing). Maybe he needs to feel like the Lord of his Manor and he can't really feel like that in someone else's house. See what I mean? (So whatever you do, don't put him on your mortgage or deed! Trust me on why....

But if he could find a way to own something, somewhere he could call his own, would that allay your fears about his decision to stay at your place? I ask because after I got the postnup and gave my WH my old house and had him sign this place over to me, he DID have his own home to go live it...and he didn't ever leave here despite my frequent suggestions that he might find it more peaceful! I guess he preferred the chaos and aggro of living with Super! Think about that option and maybe look online to see what could be found? Even a hunting cabin somewhere might satisfy that desire he may really carry.

Thanks for the feedback, Superesse. You’ve given me a lot to think about!

Update:

:::sigh:::

Depression continues. I can’t shake this heaviness that I’m feeling about our relationship now. I’m really trying to "get back in the swing of things". I’m trying to do all of our normal things that we enjoy together.

It just all feels different and I don’t know how to explain it.

I’m afraid to talk with G5 about it, which is annoying. I should feel able to talk about anything. What am I so worried about - that he will leave? He’s already proven that’s a possibility.

I’m bothered by the fact that he ended our relationship (and maybe in his mind it wasn’t "real"), and there was no concern for what if it actually ended, or that there was some expectation that I would just "take him back".

Idk. Am I making any sense?

His medical procedure is over and all is ok for the moment. I wanted to have this be a relaxing weekend free of conflict.

I can’t relax.

He isn’t feeling well today, so I don’t want to bring anything up as he’s complained in the past when I’ve tried to talk about serious stuff when he isn’t feeling his best because he has enough to deal with when he isn’t feeling well.

I’m torn between trying to pull back to protect myself and giving it my all to repair things because that’s what you do in a committed relationship, right?

At the same time, one of the other mistakes I made in my marriage was trying to do the work for both of us. I cannot do that again.

Btw - I found out my son in law reached out to G5 and basically asked when they could talk about the "miscommunication". G5 didn’t tell me about this, my daughter did. When I asked G5 about it he said,"Yeah. I didn’t know how to answer that.".

WHAT the fuck? You answer it by sharing times when you would be available to talk.

Very early in our relationship I asked G5 if he knows how to resolve conflict and he said YES. This is clearly not the case.

I reiterated before he moved in that it was unrealistic to expect we would never have conflict and he said he knew that. Come to find out his expectation of conflict was not agreeing on where the tissues are going to be, and similar things.

And by the way, I don’t think you get to count subjects you don’t give a shit about as "wins" for the other side or as examples of that partner "compromising".

I’m just having a lot of feelings today. I’m not going to be able to continue this for long. We have a cruise booked in July…

Aww, what a drag it sounds like. No wonder you are not able to relax? He doesn't strike me as a fun guy to be around.

I sure wish I had some better comments for ya regarding who we find ourselves having relationships with...but from my own experience if it is anything to go by, the same sort of man seems to latch onto me...because I guess I always came across as having my stuff together and etc. The two Husbands I've married turned out to be generally SO SERIOUS. GAHHH....I wonder if that kind of personality is a red flag we never think negatively about, when we are just dating? But a light heart is a wonderful tonic. You don't really need to engage with this, if you could somehow disconnect and go your own way, maybe an extended vacation with some family? 🙂

I concur, you need a reset. A great way would be to go away for a while or have him go away. Do you have family or friends you can visit for a week?
A healthy relationship doesn't put you in a state of depression. From the outside looking in, I see a classic example of the sunk cost theory. You're clearly not happy, but you've invested so much in this relationship. It must feel as if you cannot let go or you have wasted time and energy.
I've been healed for a long time now. I can look back on that waste of oxygen I was married to and actually see the lessons I learned about myself, people's psychology, and life and no longer feel like I wasted 10 years of my life because I learned so damn much. While I was in it (for way too long), I didn't want to give up the relationship. I felt that I was losing something if I walked away. While I may still wish I'd walked away sooner, I don't feel it was all a waste. If this is the motivation for staying in a relationship that is no longer healthy for you, please realize you aren't failing or losing anything so lkng as you walked away wiser. You can give yourself permission without feeling guilty to reach for happiness again.

He’s too serious?

If you’ve never done it, the two of you go out to a club or something, and get drunk. Drunk enough to be silly; drunk enough to make fools of yourselves.

Might have to do it a couple of times, to get him over himself.

And what BETTER day to do it, than TODAY??? ;)