SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

former bs here

There is a long list of things I regret in my marriage and divorce. I will share a couple in case they are of benefit.

#1 was underestimating what an unrepentant wayward spouse is capable of. I now view waywardness as a failure of integrity, the absence of which was very damaging

As examples

-exwh was coached to get me to be intimate with him to legally negate the impact of his repeated infidelity on the divorce

-exwh was assisted in hiding and lying about substantial assets and income

-exwh told serious and horrifically impactful lies to law enforcement, the court, and anyone who would listen to him (he purposefully went after my professional and my future ability to get a security clearance among other despicable things)

-exwh had the element of surprise—he was planning what he did to me long before he did it and I was reeling from being blindsided by an emotional 2x4

-exwh used marital counseling to shift the narrative from cheating being bad for the marriage and needing to end and the cheater work on what was wrong with them that made them cheat to actually confusing the marital counselor into questioning whose version of reality was accurate (when I had pictures of the cheating)—yes "Joe" I was telling the truth and exwh was actually cheating and it was genuinely not good for the marriage

-exwh

#2 was being "nice"

I needed to put my needs and the needs of any children first. Exwh was putting himself first

#3 was thinking exwh was the prize

There are literally probably millions of potential consensual romantic partners out there that I could have been with—I needed to stop acting like exwh was the last potential sexual and romantic partner on earth

Waywards can and do change, but it’s a lot of hard work. I personally would not choose my exwh now as a sexual and romantic partner if he was the last man on earth. He did not do the work to be a safe partner. But I say this to highlight that even divorce is not a one-way street. If a wayward does the work and the betrayed does their work and both want to get back together, it can happen even after divorce. It’s not an either/or situation

#4 failure to see the story exwh was telling

Wishing you much peace and healing as you navigate this difficult stuff.

Hello all. Well I did it. I called the OBS. I found her number through the power of the internet. She thought I was joking at first. I told her and she was in shock. She said her husband told her it was just one picture of his penis a month ago. That was it.
I told her the extent that I knew from my wife's admissions and the text exchanges I read. She said this was not the first time (surprisingly). I tried to console her. I told her to reach out to her loved one's for support. Then I told her I will not contact her again. She can reach out to me if she has any issues.
I still feel bad for ruining that lady's day but I didn't start this. I have a little more self respect though. My wife doesn't know yet. Thanks for your advice and support.

My wife doesn't know yet.

Keep it that way. If your wife comes at you, demanding to know why you did this, you can conclude:

1. More proof she’s not remorseful
2. She’s still in contact with OM

Good job! Now she has the information to make informed decisions on any life choices.

Well I did it. I called the OBS.

Excellent work btw. Great job! You did the right thing morally AND it’s high time this POS gets at least a chance at a natural consequence for his choices.

Hello again. Last night was interesting to say the least. The OBS texted me that the AP was acting erraticly after she confronted him. She thought I might be in danger (although he never made any threats). I guess the guy is also a vet and has past issues with PTSD. I assured her I would be ok.
When she confirmed he was back at work, I called my wife at work to let her know that I talked to the othe OBS. My wife took a half day and came directly home. It was a pretty turbulent night. She received a few social media messages from the OBS telling her to stay away from her husband. This sent my wife into a tailspin. She was concerned with the gossip of her coworkers/friend group.
I consoled her and made an appointment with a therapist for us. My wife was mentally hanging on by a thread it seemed.
She is better this morning because we exercised together ( it helps with stress.) I'm still stuck on what I want to do. Well atleast the OBS is notified.

Please listen to me: you can do better. As a single woman your age with lots of friends who are single, there's little doubt in my mind that if you got serious about divorcing her, you'd be happily remarried to a much better person in a few years.

It's too many years of betrayal. She's made so many bad choices for so long. This is who she is. Would you have married her knowing this is the woman she is? She's 50 and still trying to look cute for her crush so she can give him a handjob! That's teenager behavior, not a woman.

She's been obsessed with a man who becomes mentally unhinged when his secrets are revealed. She's put you and your child at risk by picking a a man that unstable. I mean, he's so mad that his betrayed wife and the husband of the woman he's been banging have been talking? That's nutso. But she thinks he's great. That shows a serious lack of judgement.

You deserve better. You deserve peace. You deserve to be able to trust the person you choose as your partner. You deserve a mature person who has her priorities set. You deserve a good mother figure for your child, so he can grow up seeing what a healthy, safe relationship looks like. It would take sooo much work to maybe even have a chance at all that with your wife. It would be so much more likely if you started over picking the right type this time around.

I'm guessing you're not there yet as far as thinking about future options, but please keep it in the back of your mind that it doesn't have to be this hard.

I feel like the responses to your updates are cooling down a little. I think that might be because we (at least I) don’t really see you following or even countering the advice offered. Frankly – we see an oncoming train crash ahead.

Look – there is no one single solution that we know will work. But there is extensive experience that shows what is not likely to work.
It’s highly unlikely that a long-term affair just ends. By exposing you have made that more likely – but while they work in close proximity...
What are her future plans? Does she plan on remaining at that place of work?
I am willing to place a huge bet on that her workplace is aware of the affair, and have been for some time. It’s near-unavoidable that someone picked up on their initial phases, that someone noticed the looks, the coincidence of them leaving at the same time, seeing her car in the parking-lot and not his, that they both took an hours lunch and not at the canteen... There is no new gossip going on, but rather the ongoing gossip about the two of them.
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Why are you seeking therapy for the both of you? Did your action make her have to have an affair?
What initiative other than promising not to have sex with OM has she shown?
Why isn’t she seeking therapy?

What about the public gossip is she afraid of? Keep in mind that maybe the ONLY way you could accept her remaining in that job (other than you decide to divorce) is if it’s common knowledge. That at least makes it hard for then to start again.

Hunter - I don't know if congratulations is quite the right word, but...I'll use kudos. Kudos on telling the OBS. It's a really hard thing to do and it takes courage and sensitivity, and it was the right thing to do. You really moved forward in the right direction on that. It's real progress.

You've got a lot of great advice on this thread, you might go back and reread it a few times, maybe take off for a couple of days and meditate on this. You don't have to stick around and "protect" your wife from the consequences of her actions (unless AP seems to be getting violent - you might want to have some minimal contact with OBS just to be somewhat informed - you could also get a protective order if you feel you or your family might be in danger). I really think some time away might benefit you. You really have to start putting yourself first here - you're the one who has been most grievously injured. Your wife brought this all on you both through her selfish and uncaring actions. Even now I get the impression she is most concerned about herself, and how if affects her with other people - NOT YOU. She doesn't want other people talking about her or thinking badly about her - that's image management. She should not have behaved in a way where she has to keep the most important thing she's doing...a secret.

I would listen to Graziella's advice here. Every comment she made is absolutely right on the money and very direct and honest and true and relevant. I think she's summed up your current situation very nicely. I know you probably have the masculine, husbandly urge to protect your wife at this point, but.....who protects you? You've got to put limits on how much she can affect you and what you want going forward in life and how much sympathy and kindness you want to give to someone who, frankly doesn't deserve it, and has created this ugly situation. And whom I believe will create other ugly situations, perhaps of different types, going forward. This is not a safe partner for you, this is a selfish, uncaring person who does indeed have terrible judgment that could be endangering. I'm not telling you to rush out today and file for a divorce (although I think divorce would be the best outcome for you) but to quell your impulses to protect her and console her. You're the one who needs that! I think IC would be a good thing for you in general to help sort out your feelings and help design an action plan. I do think planning some time by yourself, if you think it's safe, would be a good thing for you - it would help to get away from the intensity of her emotions and fears for herself. It's a long term process but you have to start with reclaiming your own life. She's just not a safe or acceptable partner, IMO.

Please stay with this site. There are many caring people here who are willing to both listen, give you the depth of their own experiences, and who really do care . You need to check in with people who care about YOU.

Hi there everyone. Just a little response. Yes Bigger my responses have cooled because I realized what a potentially explosive situation I'm in. After notifying the OBS, and telling my wife, I spent the rest of the night consoling her.
I don't really want to post details online (don't worry no domestic abuse) but her mental heath has gone to extreme levels. She refuses to go see or talk to someone individually so Im trying to atleast get her there through couples counseling.
Im also going to see an individual counselor to address my Nice Guy (codependent tendencies) in this whole ordeal. I'm also wary to creating too much of a ruckus in my neighborhood since a lot of my neighbors are LEOs too and word gets back to my management of a potentially explosive situation in my marriage. They have been known to overreact (extended desk/admin duty) at even the mere hint of domestic discord in our private lives. So yes, I'm trying to creep through this damn minefield my wife has put us in. Damn.

I’m sorry this has the potential of affecting your job.

I know you are very concerned for your wife. Her mental health is not good at this time. I am hoping part of her fragility has to do with YOU and your trauma, and not just her self-preservation.

Without remorse and her commitment to make amends, help you heal, etc. YOUR healing will be difficult.

Why is she so unwilling to accept counseling for herself as part of the recovery and reconciliation process? It’s funny how the BS runs ti get professional help but often the cheaters run away from it.

There is an old myth based on a faulty research paper from way back in the early 1970’s that stated LEO are significantly more likely to cheat than other professions. When repeated research couldn’t confirm that the original data was revisited, some glitches noted, and the result was that the divorce rate of LEO’s is above average, and that the listed causes for divorce were in the same proportions. In other words, if infidelity causes 20% of divorces (made-up figure), and if the average divorce rate is 50% then 10 non-leo couples divorce due to infidelity, but maybe 11 out of 55 leo couples.
The remarkable thing though is that the number of spouses of LEO that cheat is higher than average. In other words: there is a slightly higher chance of a LEO wife cheating than Mrs Smith, the plumbers wife.
This isn’t only LEO. Active military, paramedics, firefighters... Basically jobs where there is a certain stress or risk involved, a lot of distance, irregular hours...
Because of this MOST police departments -and especially Federal organizations – have upped their family-services to their members. Chances are you have better access to therapy and support than the average Joe. I encourage you to look into that.

Your wife – who has possibly been cheating on you in some way or another with this OM for six years – is possibly acting in a way that she knows gives her control. Possibly her reluctance to seek help is because a professional would a) call her bluff or b) require that she changes tactics.

I might come over as not believing you can reconcile. I think you can, but it requires so much more from your wife – including things like absolutely no contact with OM (even if that means leaving her job), total accountability, the total truth... I really don’t see you having any of that.

Hunter - my parents had a marriage from the pits of Hell and one element of that was my father's violent alcoholism and my mother's chronic mental illness, sometimes with psychosis. Back then - we're talking 60-70 years ago, my father used to put her in the mental hospital involuntarily when she had a psychotic break....some of these were caused by his behavior but that didn't matter as they just considered the end result. I say this as some background that I DO understand what it's like living with a spouse on the edge, your wife is not THAT bad, of course, but it's a very difficult situation to handle as inevitably you don't want to make her and the situation worse, but it does leave you open to manipulation and becoming, well, to me, a hostage. It's like you're living in a hostage situation.

I'd address this to everyone here, especially someone like Bigger who has so much experience. What can you do in a situation like this, legally, ethically, when you have a spouse whose mental state keeps you stuck like this? Aside from trying to encourage them to get help on their own, which many refuse, especially if they use this as manipulation, what other options are there? How do you move forward and hopefully develop your own life? Can you up and leave? Can you have them involuntarily committed? It feels like Hunter is stuck right now and I'm wondering what the best ways of moving forward might be?

I can't answer that question, but I can remind readers that if you think someone close to you may harm themselves or someone else, 911 is usually available.

If your wife is threatening self-harm, then you should call 911. If she's serious, then she will get the help that she needs. If she's not serious, then you've called her bluff.

But I agree with Bigger and BondJaneBond that it appears that you're being manipulated and emotionally/mentally held hostage by your wife. Instead of focusing on your own pain and betrayal, you're now focused on her comforting her-- which is the exact opposite of what you should be doing.

Couples counseling is not a substitute or even an on-ramp into individual counseling. The goal of couples counseling is to fix the relationship; the goal of IC is the fix the person. You don't have a relationship problem; you have a lying, cheating, manipulating wife problem. If you read a lot of the posts on SI, you will find that couples counseling in the immediate wake of Dday can actually make things worse, especially if you have a therapist who subscribes to the belief that infidelity is due to the cheater's "unmet needs," rather than than their poor decisions and character.

If you're worried about the impact of your home life on your job, I would get ahead of it and actually talk to your superior officer about what's going on and find out what support services are available to you. As Bigger said, you will not be the first or the last person in law enforcement to have a cheating spouse; sadly, there are a lot of betrayed spouses in your line of work.

Lastly, if you're in a one-party consent state, I highly recommend that you get a voice-activated recorder (VAR) and keep it on you at all times. The last thing you need is for your wife to make a false claim of DV that ruins your life and your career. It's very common for cheating wives to make false accusations, especially when suicide threats and crying are no longer effective manipulation tactics.

Old timer posting.
Take what you need leave the rest but please listen. And consider what I have to say. I am knowledgeable and have seen enough to know what will happen if you continue down this path.

1. Find out if you are a 1 party consent state and get every interaction on tape. She is manipulating you.

2. Do NOT allow fear of self harm prevent you from setting boundaries. If she threatens to hurt herself you call 911. I dont care if you are a cop, Dr or pastor, its your wife, you do what's right and not try to manage the situation based on profession. What happens if she does hurt herself and you haven't called and they ask why? Yes you can be held legally liable esp if her parents try to blame you. If she threatens self harm. You stop the conversation and call 911. PERIOD.

3. Set some boundaries and enforce them. Her tears and MH concerns are keeping you from setting them. Do NOT allow her to manipulate you one more minute.

4. Create a plan if this then that if that then this. Get it figured out now. Do not threaten her with enforcement of boundaries if you think you will not be able to follow through. One crossed boundary without consequence she will not believe anything you say going forward.

5. She doesn't get to set the rules on how this is going to happen. She broke the rules and trust and vows. You get to decide what R will be. Not her.

Hunter

I want you to understand where I’m coming from and how I evaluate your situation.
You posted here first six years ago about suspicions. What you had then was pretty thin and I suggested you investigate but be realistic about what you found out. After some time, you concluded that there was no infidelity going on. Based on what you shared at the time, I agreed.
Then now – six years later – you discover direct and clear evidence of an affair. No question about it. Same man as you suspected six years ago.

We can contemplate when an affair becomes an affair. Is it when she or om first hit on the other, the first flirtatious message, the first hand-holding, the first kiss, the first groping, the first sex... What I think the logical conclusion we would make – based on what you share – is that something had started when you were suspicious and that it has been going on since. What that "something" was back six years ago... is that really relevant per se?
Best-case the affair wasn’t consummated six years ago, but the seeds were sown. If the first sex was 2 years ago... well... that’s 4 years she allowed the situation to fester without doing anything to stop it.

Frankly – you can select a date at any time in the last six years ago and state the affair started then – if you base the start-date on the first physical contact (be that sex, groping, hand-holding or whatever).
Personally – I think an affair starts way before the first button is unbuttoned and the first zipper unzipped. It starts when the wayward spouse decides to enter a situation where then know a line is crossed or likely to be crossed. It starts the very second she went on a drive with him one lunch "to talk in private", away from the eyes of others at the office. The minute she didn’t push his hand off her thigh under the table at the bar at the company party.
When did that happen? It could be after that six-year date your suspicions arose. Heck... it could also have been a couple of years earlier. After all suspicions are based on something, and some things take time to become noticeable.

So this is one issue I see in your situation:
You don’t really know what you are dealing with, BUT everything strongly indicates a long-term office affair.

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Do you really think your wife can end a six year relationship just like that? Wouldn’t that in itself be a concern? IMHO the odds are higher that this rekindles than that this ends. Let’s say OM and W divorce in the next months... think OM will let your wife alone?
Infidelity is like a vampire. You really need to expose it to daylight, and then ram a stake through it to keep it down.
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You say you are in LEO, right? Imagine there was a string of five bank robberies in your area where the perpetrator is described as six foot tall, stocky and wears red pants. Then you capture a bank-robber in the act – six feet, stocky... but wearing brown khakis. You can’t connect him to the other robberies, but once he’s in custody the robberies stop. Even with no proof it’s a pretty tight deduction that this guy did the other five before switching pants. It’s then your task to connect him to the other five, and even if you can’t then ensure he gets his sentence for what can be proved.

Your wife’s situation allows comparable deductions. We know she had an affair. We know who OM is. What we don’t know is when, how and for how long.
Our experience strongly suggests – like in 99% of instances – that the total truth is never attainable at first. Nothing you share about your wife indicates a real "come to Jesus" moment where she realizes the truth is required. Instead we get a typical description of minimizing. "Only" once, "only" a hand-job, "only" oral, "only" since April last year...
Now – this might all be true. Just like maybe a couple of years from now when khaki-pants is doing time you get a new bank-robbery with a six-foot, stocky, red-pants thief... But you really need to verify it all.

A key to reconciling is realizing what you are reconciling from. Big difference in a 72 month affair and an 18 month one... You need to understand why they were OK with being flirty for about 55 months before she "only" gave him a hand-job. You need to be convinced you know what started it, how it progressed and what funneled each ongoing step.
Your wife is NOT allowed the luxury of thinking she got away with 55 months, or not letting you know about the PIV sex, or the time she had him in your house, or the time they did it in her car, or the time they were caught at the office or whatever.
Reconciliation comes from total honesty. I don’t think you have anything close to that as-is.

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Your WW mental state. There is nothing mentally logical about infidelity. Again – if I refer to the bank-robber analogy – no logical or sensible man choses that career. Yet that doesn’t make them crazy. I find it "convenient" for your wife that she can be logical enough to have an affair – possibly for over 6 years, hide it from you, hide it from colleagues, finance it, hide the time it took from your family... and NOW she cracks...

Sorry – but I tie that a lot more into some effort to control you. To prevent a divorce, to prevent you pressing for the answers you should be needing. I take mental health seriously, but I don’t think your wife is as mentally weak as you think.
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The general consensus here on SI is that a WS and the OP can’t work together. One or the other needs to change jobs. He might be in another department in another building, but there is too much opportunity to interact. It’s like expecting a recovering alcoholic to work as a bartender.
Then there is the more-or-less given truth that others at work KNOW.
What about the annual Christmas party? You OK with her being there? You OK with the snide looks and sniggers if you attend with her? You OK with seeing OM at the other end of the room, laughing with management?
Think this constant trigger helps you and the marriage recover?

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You mention a covenant marriage. It’s been suggested that no matter what you decide eventually then you use this opportunity to have some form of acceptance of divorce terms ready. That could be a simple statement where she agrees to a divorce without the hassle of a covenant marriage. But I guess the fear of her mental state protects her from those consequences.

Hunter – I see you in a very precarious situation where you are making things harder for yourself. You are working from the premise that you can save your marriage.
You can’t...
What might save your marriage is if BOTH of you were to work at saving it. That can’t be done from half-truths and rug-sweeping. Your wife had an AFFAIR. She willingly and freely flirted with, conversed with, met with, had sex with and committed to another man. Not only that – but AT THE VERY LEAST this has been building up for over SIX years. There is no "nice-ing" this away. This is nitty-gritty and dirty work. First in totally killing the affair and then from a base of total truth. Until you have that truth, your wife is placing just as much effort into protecting her affair as she might be in saving the marriage.

I hope you see I do think you two can reconcile. Only that right now, I don’t think you have what is required. No matter how much YOU might want to reconcile.